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[Camresearch]

New brushes arrived today from Thuderstruck, a week or so too late to save the DS 2010 from the crusher
 http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/perm-pmg-132-brush-kit.html They are for a Perm 132 DC motor, similar in design to the Agni...

I couldn't yet get Agni brushes and I thought I would try these.. I got them for $64 plus postage of $71! anyway I had been quoted over $300 plus postage for Agni brushes so I wanted to find out if these would work but it was a gamble.  THEY ARE NOT A DROP IN REPLACEMENT OF THE CRAPPY AGNI BRUSHES! 

I never got a chance to test them because the final decision has been to scrap the 2010 DS as a trade in... Zero's suggestion and kind offer....

I think with some careful modifications to the existing carrier they MIGHT work (I never got the chance to test the idea).... They should be far better than the Agni brushes if they do... They will provide better and more contact with the commutator to reduce heating and they should be stronger.  I would also suggest moving the heat sensor from the negative brushes to the positive ones, since if it is going to catastrophically heat up, then it is the positives that burn up first!!

The Agni brushes are 19 mm wide and so are these but the thickness across the body of the brush in the 132 brush varies from the inside width of about 2 mm to an outer edge width of just around 4.5 mm!! That is a lot more contact area, the original Agni brushes are just flat 2 mm along the whole profile.  Also the connector used on the pigtail is copper and bonded directly to the brush, not cheaply riveted...

Dimensions:
19 mm wide 4.5 mm thick on outer edge just under 2 mm thick on inner edge. 21 mm long 80 mm to center of connector tab of pig tail from back shoulder of brush. a 90 mm pigtail compare to 75 mm Agni but all copper.

If you didn't want to modify your carrier you could IMHO use them as drop in replacements IF YOU VERY! CAREFULLY GROUND THEM FLAT.  Chances are if you are careless, worst case you would break them or fracture them and not know, go slow if you try that option.  With the benefit of around 50% additional contact area and physical strength, I would have tried to mill a new carrier from a 90 mm diameter section of PTFE (Teflon), that should take the heat and is slippery so would facilitate brush movement.  Dust build up and heat are the two factors that you would need to consider in the milling design... More work but IMHO would give you a much better motor!  Especially if you could make it so the new carrier was capable of on demand rotating a mm into rotation on the fly to give you a high speed running function, save power at speed and have more.


Cheers,
Cam

[Camresearch]

Damn I just couldn't help myself I had to do, it... The Perm 132 brushes are working    I had to try them, even though the bike is going to the dealer as a trade in and it makes no difference if the bike is running or not... I just couldn't let the bike go to the dealer like a dead horse to the knackers yard,    even though now it will be a live horse going to the knackers yard,  if Zero ends up stripping it and crushing what's left... too bad.  I would like to take the bike for one last ride up into the bush before it goes too... I don't want to remember this bike, as having being the last time I took it out, having to push it 3 km home from town....   It may end up being 10 km home from the bush this time, we'll see.

I have attached a picture of the charred and modified brush carrier...
There isn't much left of the charred brush carrier now... Therefore this is assembled just to see if the alternative brushes could be made to work. I no longer have need of the new brushes anyway, so they may as well go with the bike and help to let me take the 2010 for one last ride, that and to prove that I could get a better result not spending the $300 for a set of Agni brushes, that I have yet to be able to get until October....

If you don't want to drill and file your carrier, then file the brushes... You will have less contact area if you choose that option though.
To modify the Agni carrier I aimed to keep the existing alignment and widen the outer edge hole symmetrically. 

Once done no other mods were required... I am moving the heat sensor to the positive brushes just for the hell of it... 1 min job and some glue...

I have found these brushes hard wearing, that and increased contact area means a longer run in period... running at 12 volts, remove the brushes and check for even wear... I already have reground and cleaned up the commutator.  You can see on the photo, that these brushes still have some wearing in to do, they have been running in the motor at 12 volts for about an hour in the picture, the 5 that are in their holders are being held back for mounting, I let one up to show the shape and length.



Cam

[Cortezdtv]

You want that sensor on the negative!!!

[Camresearch]

You want that sensor on the negative!!!

I know it is mounted on the negative, but it was all the positive brushed that burned first... If it is getting hot, it will get hot at the positive first... Why does it need to be monitoring the negative?

Cam

[Camresearch]

Hi Guys,

The picture here is of the Perm 132 brushes in the Agni carrier after 1 hour at 12 volts.  These brushes are very slow wearing.  They will take longer than normal to wear in.  Wearing in is a step that you don't want to skip....  I will let it run until it is worn in properly....

Cam

[Camresearch]

I couldn't let the 2010 die on its knees not if I could help it...

I have managed to get it going using the perm 132 brushes, in the burnt Agni brush carrier, that I have modified to take them... Nothing to lose since the bike is going in as a trade in on a new 2014 DS next week. Unfortunately it looks like the 2010 DS is destined to be stripped and crushed, as I understand it.... 

Cam

[Richard230]

It will be too bad if your 2010 gets "stripped and crushed".  I always liked the look of the 2010 and 2011 Zeros (if not the performance). I hope Zero can keep a few around for future historians to ponder over a hundred years from now.   

[Camresearch]

It will be too bad if your 2010 gets "stripped and crushed".  I always liked the look of the 2010 and 2011 Zeros (if not the performance). I hope Zero can keep a few around for future historians to ponder over a hundred years from now.   

Yeah, I thought about boxing it up and keeping it in a basement somewhere but the offer of a trade in on an actual bike that you can actually get parts for, was just too tempting....  I have only heard rumors of two others left in Australia...

Cam

[drumgadget]

Yer a brave man, Cam!  I admire your DIY expertise AND your noble sentiment towards your crippled 2010 ......

Mike