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Author Topic: Still powered after removing key  (Read 3717 times)

PhreaK

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Still powered after removing key
« on: June 11, 2015, 07:42:56 PM »

So, I've run into a little bit of an issue unique to EV's. My 2014 SR won't ummm... turn off.

To clarify, this isn't a 'I removed the key and the headlight is still on' type scenario, this is a 'the bike has been off and the key in my back pocket for the past 15 minutes, yet everything is still on and I can still just turn off the kill switch and ride to my hearts content' situation. From what I can see, I'm not doing anything stupid and it does appear to de-power properly after 20-30 minutes, however not the best for a bike that will be regularly parked on the street.

This is on a second hand 2014 SR I've literally just picked up (arrived today after being freighted across the country). It's still under factory warranty and I have contacted Zero and the local dealer, however has anyone else run into this or anything similar?
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2014 Zero SR

oobflyer

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2015, 07:47:19 PM »

I never saw this on my 2012 Zero, or on my 2015 Zero, but it happened once on my Vectrix. After trying to cycle the bike on and off with the key (without success) I found that when I plugged the bike in, as if to start charging, the bike reset itself and I could then unplug the bike and all was well. It hasn't happened again since then.
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Burton

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2015, 07:47:39 PM »

Does this always happen? Or was this the first time you ever started it up so you don't know.

I would look at the wire loom coming from the ignition switch. Not sure if the wires are identical in color as they are on my 2013 bike but you could probably "turn the bike off" by simply disconnecting the ignition from the wire loom. If this doesn't work then there is another issue outside of the ignition being bad.
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PhreaK

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2015, 08:15:16 PM »

It's still early days when it comes to diagnostics. I'm going to dive into it a bit more tomorrow and see what I can do to form steps to reproduce - it's late over here and have been flat out all day. Power cycling does not rectify, but have not tried plugging into charge yet (nowhere to charge at home, ah, the joys of apartment living).

The bike has just been freighted interstate so wouldn't be surprised if something has come loose. I'll break out the multimeter tomorrow and narrow it down to either a software or hardware fault.
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2014 Zero SR

Cortezdtv

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2015, 08:17:05 PM »

Always try cycling they key a few times
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Richard230

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #5 on: June 11, 2015, 08:18:16 PM »

Could this be a problem with the "contactor" not disengaging?  Maybe it needs a sharp tap with a hammer to get it back to normal?   ;)
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peter

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2015, 04:29:36 AM »

I had the bike stay on with the key off - 2012XU.

Details on experiences with that bike are here - http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=3504.0

Turned out to be the DC-DC converter.

If you disconnect your ignition switch from the loom & the lights stay on, that might be your answer. If it's the same DC-DC converter as on the 2012XU (anyone know?) I can dig up the emails I had form a Zero tech to diagnose that as the fault, if you need it.

hth
Peter
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SopFu

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2015, 04:30:01 AM »

Had the same thing happen to my Empulse when it was new, after riding in the rain. Ended up being a leaky connector near the ignition. Some gaffer tape around the connectors and dielectric grease fixed the problem.

http://brammoforum.com/index.php?topic=1989.msg15475#msg15475
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peter

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2015, 04:35:40 AM »

Btw did the previous owner have this problem? This is a second hand 2014 bike? Do you know why was it sold?

Peter
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PhreaK

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2015, 12:14:50 PM »

Oh man, the saga continues. Tried all the simple things (cycling the key switch, connecting to a charger etc) that I image would force a state change and get any stuck contactors to open / close. No dice. In case anyone is interested you can see a video here and here of what was happening.

The morning after this I turned the bike on, after it ran through the init sequence all of the LCD segments started flashing and got nothing from the rest of the bike (video here). At this point I gave Zero HQ a call and was able to speak to one of the service guys straight away (seriously, awesome support). After a couple of attempts to get a phone line where we could hear each other thanks to the wonderful, modern telecommunications infrastructure of Australia he had a chat to a few of the other guys there and suggested it was likely an issue with the DC-DC converter. Now the bike is obviously not mobile at this point so after asking nicely they emailed a schematic for that section of the system and some instructions to test and confirm the fault. Perfect.

Only problem is whoever last had this bike open was a little overzealous on the Loctite for the seat bolts judging by the amount on the left hand side. After spending Friday evening trying myself and this morning at the local bike mechanic (within pushing distance) I now have a completely burred right hand side bolt and no way to extract short of drilling it out and re-tapping or replacing the support bar that the seat uses to mount to the frame. At this point I've admitted defeat and organised for towing the the dealer next week. It's still within the factory warranty period so the issue can be sorted a little easier and will also be simpler to organise any replacement parts for bits that need to be sacrificed to get the f*#cking seat off.

What I'm really hoping is that if anything has been left active, it's not going to cause a deep discharge of the batteries...

@peter, sounds pretty similar to the issue you had with the 2012XU. Also, in regards to the previous owner, the bike was purchased from a car dealer where the owner had traded it so unsure of history of the issue. When tested ridden and inspected it worked as expected but it may well have faulted previously and triggered the trade in. A little google fu was able to identify the original owner and he appears to be the type that would opt to just guy by a new vehicle rather than taking the old one to a mechanic. The dealer did provided a 3 month warranty and it's still within the factory warranty as well so not overly concerned about the ability to get it resolved. Just a bit of an annoyance as it's a beautiful weekend down here and I want to ride my 2 wheel space ship.
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2014 Zero SR

nigezero

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2015, 05:02:16 PM »

Phreak; bad luck man, I hope you get through it quickly. My experience with pretty much every bolt is they are rubbish. Get a box full of replacement ones - I use ss- and really carefully extract them with a good hit and a new tool. Did you get the bargain SR in Sydney? I met the former owners mate by chance last week at a bike cafe near me in Sydney.
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PhreaK

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2015, 06:49:01 PM »

Yeah these things happen. Worse part is the other bike (ironically) has an electrical fault at the moment too. I've got a list of a few parts that'll be swapped out once the warranty is up and looks like some of the mounting hardware will be joining that list. And yep, this is that SR - picked it up for a great price.
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2014 Zero SR

peter

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2015, 04:31:06 AM »

Just seconding what nigezero said - the fasteners on our 2012 XU are rubbish. The metal is more like plasticine on most of the bolts. Use your mancave's bolt supply when replacing.

Peter
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PhreaK

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2015, 07:06:34 PM »

One and half weeks down and still no closer to a fix...

Bike made it to the local dealer last Monday. After I called to follow up today they said they're waiting on Zero, yet when I last spoke with Zero they hadn't heard from the dealer. Joy.
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2014 Zero SR

nigezero

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Re: Still powered after removing key
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2015, 07:27:37 PM »

Sheesh. Early adopting is hard sometimes. BTW, I highly recommend having a spare charger or two on hand. Great for long trips or fast charging at home. I share a pair with another owner.
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