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Author Topic: Lithium Ion (Li-ion) Batteries used in Zero Motorcyles - all you need to know  (Read 39953 times)

ArnoldOuistiti

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Thanks guys!
You are just amazing! Incredible how much you know about the bike and much more!

My business is very slow to start here in France, I wish we have much more open and clever guys like you down here, showing the way to renewable energy and all the possibilities re Electric Vehicle storage.
Looking forward to riding my 2015 DS (I've tested it twice, it's a great bike that will make me drive 100% on my own produced energy). I currently own a Honda VFR 1200X which is also a great bike but much more for very long ride cross France and not short commute trips.

Keep on e-riding and rollin' guys

Arnold
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Kocho

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I don't see how that would really save energy in a  realistic situation. If one is only using 1/2 the fridge all the time, then yes, fill up with water bottles. Better yet - get a smaller fridge. But our fridge is full on Sunday, empty by Friday. Taking out all cold water bottles on Sunday and recooling them on Friday (or during the week incrementally) I think will only waste energy vs. the energy wasted to cool air when the door is opened and closed during the week.

With water bottles one can regulate *when* the fridge works hard, and if one is powering it by solar it makes sense to cool the water off during the day when it is "free" to do so. For  regular utility customers like me who pay a flat rate electricity regardless of time of day I don't see how water bottles loading would help at all and it seems to me it will hurt overall.

At night with the door closed the fridge didn't need to run and only went up about 1 degree, but I had it set for a colder temperature during the day and filled it full of water bottles in the freezer part too.
off topic, but it amazes me that everyone doesnt know this.. keep your freezer and fridge full of water bottles, and it will hold the temp better.. an empty fridge "pours" out all the cold air everything you open the door. but once you cool the water, it takes alot for it to warm up, and it keeps the fridge from working as hard.  so if your fridge is not full all the time, keep it full with water bottles. You can always take them out if you buy a bunch of food.
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'15 Zero SR

MrDude_1

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I don't see how that would really save energy in a  realistic situation. If one is only using 1/2 the fridge all the time, then yes, fill up with water bottles. Better yet - get a smaller fridge. But our fridge is full on Sunday, empty by Friday. Taking out all cold water bottles on Sunday and recooling them on Friday (or during the week incrementally) I think will only waste energy vs. the energy wasted to cool air when the door is opened and closed during the week.

With water bottles one can regulate *when* the fridge works hard, and if one is powering it by solar it makes sense to cool the water off during the day when it is "free" to do so. For  regular utility customers like me who pay a flat rate electricity regardless of time of day I don't see how water bottles loading would help at all and it seems to me it will hurt overall.

At night with the door closed the fridge didn't need to run and only went up about 1 degree, but I had it set for a colder temperature during the day and filled it full of water bottles in the freezer part too.
off topic, but it amazes me that everyone doesnt know this.. keep your freezer and fridge full of water bottles, and it will hold the temp better.. an empty fridge "pours" out all the cold air everything you open the door. but once you cool the water, it takes alot for it to warm up, and it keeps the fridge from working as hard.  so if your fridge is not full all the time, keep it full with water bottles. You can always take them out if you buy a bunch of food.

you need to just do whatever makes sense for you... Think of the water as a kind of thermal flywheel.
If you're going to open the door all the time, it helps keep it cool. If you want it to run at max then stay off for awhile, it helps.
Since most refrigerators work at one rate, and then cut on and off to stay within a range, this flywheel effect can keep it off for longer.
At home if you get multiple rate electricity, and dont leave the door open you can actually set it to only power on when power is cheaper too.

I use this trick for my freezer, as it starts full, then gets lower over time, so most of the time its more than half empty, but I cant get a smaller freezer or I wouldnt be able to fit everything when I first get it. Its not opened often, so it has its power through a timer to cut on only at night, and it has an override that will bypass the timer to power it on full if the temp ever rises above 32F (0C).

it does take energy to initially freeze the water, but the water stays frozen unless its needed, plus I have a backup supply of cold fresh water if bad weather hits.
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NanoMech

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    • Angler Wranglers Demolition Co., est 1895

It's a bit off topic, but thought some readers may find interest in the casual comparisons of various materials energy densities:  http://graphics.wsj.com/iphone-battery/#/?q=0
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2014 Zero DS "Wrangler", PowerTank, 25T drive sprocket: www.AnglerWranglers.com

qorw

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Hey Electric Terry, its great to see that you are off-grid and power stuff in your house from the Zero's battery... but please tell us how you recharge your Zero then?

I am taking delivery of my Zero DS 11.4 in a few days time and have been in contact with the manufacturer in the USA (without much luck) regarding a solar PV charge option for the Zero. As I see it one should be able to get an off-board aux DC-DC charger for the bike and use it just like the Delta-Q charger, BUT the Zero sales manager says its' impossible!?

Sounds a bit crazy to put up 4 x 300W solar panels and convert their DC output to AC with an expensive inverter just to have the Delta-Q off-board charger convert the AC back to DC to charge the Zero's batteries!?

I even emailed Delta-Q to ask them why they don't sell an MPPT type PV solar panel charger for the Zero's batteries? No Reply (PS there are other LiIoPho4 battery suppliers who will gladly sell you a solar PV MPPT charger for their batteries, so common Zero, please get your minds to this.)

I live in Cape Town South Africa, have a 36km commute into town and can leave the bike charging in the great african sunshine for the whole day before hoping back on it to make the trip home... even in winter (coldest it gets is 7 deg C .... with still about 300 Watt per sq m sunshine)

All I need is a Delta-Q solar charger :-) please...
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2014 Zero DS, 2010 BMW R1200R, 2013 BMW F800GS

Fivespeed302

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Anyone know how much the 13.0 battery weighs?  I was just curious because the title says everything you need to know, but that part is left out.  I can't seem to find that info anywhere either.
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2015 Zero SR
2009 Yamaha R1

Shadow

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Anyone know how much the 13.0 battery weighs?  I was just curious because the title says everything you need to know, but that part is left out.  I can't seem to find that info anywhere either.
At a guess, 300lbs. It is four of the 75lb modules so... unless someone has weighed theirs?

Snarky retort: Charged or discharged?
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mrwilsn

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Anyone know how much the 13.0 battery weighs?  I was just curious because the title says everything you need to know, but that part is left out.  I can't seem to find that info anywhere either.
At a guess, 300lbs. It is four of the 75lb modules so... unless someone has weighed theirs?

Snarky retort: Charged or discharged?

75 lbs?? 44 lbs I think.

Anyone know how much the 13.0 battery weighs?  I was just curious because the title says everything you need to know, but that part is left out.  I can't seem to find that info anywhere either.

2016 Zero SR ZF13 = 414 lbs
2016 Zero SR ZF16.3 (power tank) = 458 lbs

2017 Zero SR ZF13 = 408 lbs
2017 Zero SR ZF16.3 (power tank) = 452 lbs

So the extra battery brick for the power tank = ~44 lbs

A ZF13 monolith has the equivalent of 4 bricks so 44 lbs x 4 = ~176 lbs

That's probably a more accurate number for a 2016 ZF13 bike since they actually have 4 bricks.  For 2017, a ZF13 has only 2 long bricks so there might be a slight weight savings there.  A 2017 ZF13 bike is 6 lbs lighter than a 2016 ZF13 bike.  There are other changes besides 4 brick to 2 long brick (wider belt with different gear sizes, lockable storage tank instead of the bag etc.) but 176 +/- 6 lbs should be a safe bet.
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2014 Zero S

wontuan

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Bare brick is about 38lb
« Last Edit: June 07, 2017, 12:42:25 PM by wontuan »
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Fivespeed302

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Thanks for the replies. I figured someone out there had weighed it at some point.  I get asked that question from time to time. 
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2015 Zero SR
2009 Yamaha R1
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