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Author Topic: 2015 lineup!  (Read 3480 times)

LiveandLetDrive

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2015 lineup!
« on: September 30, 2014, 11:59:51 AM »

You all asleep?   ;)

http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/motorcycles/

I'll leave the analysis to everybody else!
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2013 Zero FX, 2005 Triumph Sprint ST, 2000 Triumph Tiger, 1970 Triumph T100R Daytona, 1970 Honda SL100  (Latter three for sale!)

dubster

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #1 on: September 30, 2014, 12:17:51 PM »

great, ABS!!!!
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Justin Andrews

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #2 on: September 30, 2014, 12:41:18 PM »

Not just ABS, they've changed the brakes as well. Gone from Nissin to Bosch, and finally replaced the rear brake too, that's potentially good news. 

Bigger battery by 1.1kWh, Power tank capacity looks unchanged.

Sadly no increase in charger capacity. That's a disappointment.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2014, 02:38:42 PM by Justin Andrews »
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Francois

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #3 on: September 30, 2014, 01:56:30 PM »

not exactly pass from 185 to 188kg 3kg more
the back suspension look prety good lot bigger
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evtricity

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #4 on: September 30, 2014, 02:04:46 PM »

ABS was the key change delivered for 2015.

10% more battery and ABS for 3kg more weight is impressive. Maybe they lost some weight in the wheels and shocks?

Good to see the Pirellis on there - much better than the IRCs.

Brakes are now all J juan - not sure whether that's actually a downgrade for the front as the j juan rear on the 2014 is not so good.

Price increase under USD500 not bad considering the cost of ABS and other upgrades.

For the 2014 owners, hopefully there will be options to retrofit ABS or the Showa rear shock.
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protomech

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2014, 02:38:35 PM »

Main story seems to be that Zero has access to a higher tier of suppliers. Fast Ace suspension replaced with Showa components, Bosch ABS brake systems (rotors are J-Juan in front and rear, vs Nissin front and J-Juan rear in 2014). IRC tires replaced with Pirellis. New mirror design.

I think Zero finally has components that are appropriate for the price. Which is good, because every model was bumped upwards by $350.

The FX soldiers on with no changes other than the components above. The ZF2.8 modules are identical to 2014.

In addition to the component changes, the S/DS/SR bikes all have 10% more capacity for the non-power tank bikes. Like the 2010 => 2011 capacity increase, Zero is probably using a cell configuration with 10% more amp-hours at the same voltage. This add little weight - about 10 pounds - and range improves by about 10%. Not bad.

The largest Zero now has 94 miles of constant 70 mph range, and can ride for > 2 hours at constant 55 mph. Incremental gains over 2014, but the increase in range is essentially "free".

***

Some interesting comparisons:

The ZF8.5 is replaced with the ZF9.4. An interesting point of comparison is the 2012 S ZF9; the smallest 2015 Zero S now has more capacity than the largest 2012 Zero S. The 2015 bike weighs about 30 more pounds and has about the same city range, but component quality is much higher, it's much quicker (~10s 0-60 vs 4.8s), it charges more quickly, and highway-only range is about 30% higher.

Oh, and the 2015 bike costs $650 less than the 2012. Big big strides for Zero in a small period of time.

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Unfortunately, the big loser is the charging. Zero still has no effective solution for high-power J1772 charging, though they continue to sell the $300 J1772 adapter. The expensive and limited compatibility CHAdeMO charging accessory is still available for the 2013-2014 bikes, but is not listed as compatible with the 2015 bikes.

Zero has clarified the number of accessory 1 kW chargers that can be slaved together to charge more quickly: the FX ZF2.8 can take 1 external charger, the FX ZF5.7 can take 3 external chargers, and all S/DS/SR bikes can take 4 external chargers. This is probably aimed at fleet sales; the Zero S bikes can add 52 miles of mixed riding with a 1 hour charge, allowing a police officer to return to home base for paperwork or lunch and pick up significant additional charge.

***

I hope hope hope that Zero has spent engineering time to make its 2015 bikes bulletproof from a reliability and durability standpoint, as well as time grooming and training their dealer network who are now going on their third year of this generation of bike. User forums will always over-represent failures, and I suspect the 2014s are more reliable than the 2013s, but I hope to see a marked reduction in errors for 2015.

***

So who's going to buy the 2015 bikes, and why?

* some 2012 and 2013 owners will upgrade, especially as their bikes fall out of warranty.
* higher-spec components will draw some who turned up their noses previously
* ABS is a big win for rider safety
* Zero is whittling away at single-charge range anxiety
* the smallest S bike is a straight upgrade for 2012 S ZF9 owners (like myself), and has very useful range for almost any rider
* the middle S bike offers most of the range of the 2014 S ZF11.4 + Power Tank model at a much lower cost/weight and while preserving the "tank bag"
* the largest S bike offers significant single-charge range, at significant cost

Who's not going to buy?

* Zero dropped their entry-level XU bike for 2014, and increases prices across the board for 2015. I think the overall value is higher than it's ever been, but there are effectively no routes to owning a new Zero that doesn't start at $12k.
* Expecting faster J1772 charging? Go straight to Harlan @ HollywoodElectrics and/or Brammo.
* Looking for faster DC Quick Charging? Try again in 2016; if the 2015 bikes are like the 2011, then perhaps the 2016 bikes will introduce a higher voltage battery and significant motor / controller changes.
* Styling changes minor, limited to wheels, mirrors, and the red rear shock.
* Anyone who can't sit on a bike at their local dealer probably isn't going to buy. It seems Zero has been signing up more dealers though; and the Harley Project Livewire tour has significantly raised awareness of electric bikes. $18k for the big-battery Zero S will buy a bike that's faster, cheaper, lighter, easier to ride, and (in some cases) has more range than the Harleys.
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Mike Werner

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2014, 04:39:35 PM »

Looks like no need for me to go to the press conference, since everything has already been told and shown. So I guess I have some time to visit other deserving stands. And give my tired feet a break...

ultrarnr

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2014, 05:28:31 PM »

protomech,

I think it is going to be a long time before we see L2 charging on a Zero. There is just no place to put it other than bolting it either to the side case mounts or putting them inside the side cases. And yes that could be an option for Zero. Myself and several others here have it set up that way. But adding two Elcons to your bike also adds about 30 pounds or so and it definitely effects handling. Riding the Tail of the Dragon in western NC is definitely easier without the Elcons mounted on the bike.

Whether CHAdeMO is a good option depends on where you live. I am in NC and I have ordered a CHAdeMO for my SR but they are not yet available. There are enough CHAdeMO systems around NC that it is definitely worth getting and there is a company that is going to install another 18 systems beginning next month.

It would be really great to have a 6.6KW L2 charging system on a Zero that didn't add a lot of weight or take up much space but think we are a few years away from that.
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snapcrackleflop

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2014, 06:46:14 PM »

The one thing I was really hoping for was a reduction in the cost per kWh, especially on the FX. But with the 5.7 kWh version still costing $2500 more than the base model, Zero is still charging about $1000 per kWh. If you look at the costs per kWh for cars like the Leaf and the Tesla, this is several times more expensive.
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firepower

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2014, 06:57:47 PM »

Thanks for your summary protomech.
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DynoMutt

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2014, 07:54:43 PM »

That new lineup is fscking SICK!  I'd love to see backporting of some features to protect my investment.  I'd also love to see a platform that is designed to accept incremental improvements in a modular fashion to allow for component replacement while preserving the core investment, which is the monolith.  I'd love to see a time that I could buy a power tank that has the same or greater capacity as the monolith on my current motorcycle.  I'd look forward to wearing this thing out in 5-10 years and when I'm ready to buy another one, the battery capacity has doubled or tripled and be able to carry components over.  I'd love to be able to recycle my old monolith into a solar panel storage battery after the motorcycle wrapped around it has worn out.

I'm a bit of a dreamer ;)
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Patrick Truchon

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2014, 08:01:20 PM »

For Canadians, the price difference is $1300 for the S and DS, and $1605 for the SR.  Around Christmas last year, the Canadian dollar was at around 0.95, now it's at 0.89, which reflect the price difference almost exactly.  Unfortunately, I didn't get a 7% raise last year, so I might try to see if I can buy a 2014 instead.  Or, I wonder if I can wait for the loony to bounce back and buy it in USD a bit later...
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DynoMutt

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2014, 08:20:14 PM »

Note, the accessories page has been updated, but there's no mention of CHAdeMO for the '15s at this point.

I hope they haven't abandoned the standard.  Yes, I know that

I'm a fan of CHAdeMO because CHAdeMO appears to me to be internationally consistent, Combo is not.

Combo has "Type 1" and "Type 2", which is dependent upon what the locally-prevailing AC fast-charging standard connector is.  I don't want to have a situation where I have to buy a new motorcycle because I move to another country where the AC standard is different or the bike is more difficult to sell because there's a smaller pool of potential buyers because the AC standard is different.

Having one connector doesn't matter as much to me as having a consistent connector that works everywhere.

What'd be really great is if the QC package could just have a location to fit it onto the motorcycle and have it be modular, and have it receive the charger connector on one end and output into the Anderson power connector on the other.  If it could be stowed underneath the seat, it'd be ideal.  That way, it'd be possible to keep the QC independent of the manufactured motorcycle but still reasonably easy to transport, and riders would be able to choose which standard for QC they want.

Yes, this is a total threadjack.
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trikester

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2014, 08:23:38 PM »

I wonder why the 2015 FX is heavier than my 2013 FX? The battery didn't change capacity. Do the new shocks and ABS add that much? I'd much rather exchange weight for more capacity.

Trikester

BTW - Had a great time dirt riding in SE Utah on my Zero powered (2013 MX/FX Powertrain) e-trike. Running like a champ!
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DesignerDan

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Re: 2015 lineup!
« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2014, 08:33:21 PM »

What I want to know is if those cool new, light weight wheels can be used on a 2013 Zero.
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