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Author Topic: Empulse reliability  (Read 3852 times)

oregonrider89

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Empulse reliability
« on: March 30, 2014, 08:15:57 PM »

Hi,

This post is for current Empulse owners from a current (2010 DS...I know, ancient technology) Zero owner. I will be buying new next April but have not decided which bike to buy, Brammo or Zero. Mission is too expensive for me.

In my observation Brammo owners never seem to post topics about problems with the Empulse so I wondered if a few owners might post their mileage totals and reliability experience. I know all about Zero's problems and what they have done to address things.

So, how many miles have you ridden and have you had any issues? If you have had issues has Brammo been responsive to your needs?

Thank you,
Oregonrider89
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benswing

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2014, 08:46:07 PM »

There are a couple of Empulse riders on this forum, but most of them are on the www.BrammoForum.com

Here is an example of issues a Brammo rider has had with his Empulse. 

http://brammoforum.com/index.php?topic=2380.0

With the 6-speed transmission you can expect a slightly greater probability of having issues (ie - more moving parts=more possibilities for things to mess up).  I haven't read the BrammoForum extensively, but I know a couple of guys over there and they are great people and just as enthused about their bikes as we are about ours!

It would be nice if we all were on the same forum, but it didn't work out that way so far.
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frodus

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2014, 11:20:25 PM »

Mine has been problem free. Only had to go in for an inspection of my battery cables and a firmware update. Have about 2500 miles on mine so far and it's been great.
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Richard230

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #3 on: March 31, 2014, 04:09:03 AM »

I check the Brammo forum almost ever day and I have only read a few comments from people having some minor problems.  The Empulse seems to be better developed and assembled than your typical Zero - which makes sense as Brammo spent a lot of time getting the bike right before putting it on the market. Plus, Brammo seems to provide better factory-direct after-sales support. I kind of see Brammo as being the tortoise and Zero the hare in the race to market electric motorcycles to the average consumer.  However, I think you could be happy with either bike, especially if you have a dealer not too far away.

Your decision may boil down to what kind of riding will you be doing?  If you are a sport bike rider, the Empulse would be the way to go.  If you are a commuter and/or want to use your bike for general transportation and utility purposes, the Zero would be more practical.
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WindRider

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2014, 08:37:39 PM »

I would add that Zero's FX and DS are dirt road and trail capable and Brammo does not deliver a bike for anything but asphalt as yet if that is a factor.

Consider local dealer support heavily if you buy Zero.
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BrammoBrian

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2014, 12:05:08 AM »

Hi,

This post is for current Empulse owners from a current (2010 DS...I know, ancient technology) Zero owner. I will be buying new next April but have not decided which bike to buy, Brammo or Zero. Mission is too expensive for me.

In my observation Brammo owners never seem to post topics about problems with the Empulse so I wondered if a few owners might post their mileage totals and reliability experience. I know all about Zero's problems and what they have done to address things.

So, how many miles have you ridden and have you had any issues? If you have had issues has Brammo been responsive to your needs?

Thank you,
Oregonrider89

I would never go so far as to say we have no issues with our bikes, but we work very hard to validate our engineering to avoid problems and then resolve them quickly if they do arise.  We have an extensive service diagnostics kit that all dealers have as well as a dealer portal for sending out technical bulletins and firmware updates when needed.  If a problem becomes too tricky for a dealer, our factory service team can remote in to the service tablet and take over the update/repair.





Let me know if you have any technical questions about the Empulse and I'd be happy to post the answers here...
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NoiseBoy

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2014, 03:25:04 PM »

Could you summarise the service requirements Brian?  How often does the gearbox oil need changing? Is the gearbox harder wearing than a comparable ICE gearbox?

Having experienced the joys of a belt final drive, i'd be interested to know why Brammo opted to use a chain.
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Justin Andrews

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2014, 07:24:32 PM »

I'm kinda curious about the chain as well, however when it comes to replacing a chain, chains are a lot less heartache to replace than a belt.

The feeling I get with the Empulse is that Brammo seems to have gone down the route of it being a motorbike that just happens to be electric drive. Something which I think might be a fairly smart move when it comes to winning over regular bikers.
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BrammoBrian

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2014, 10:10:20 PM »

Could you summarise the service requirements Brian?  How often does the gearbox oil need changing? Is the gearbox harder wearing than a comparable ICE gearbox?

Having experienced the joys of a belt final drive, i'd be interested to know why Brammo opted to use a chain.

You can find the recommended service intervals for the Empulse in the back of the owner's manual here:

https://www.brammo.com/documents/Empulse_Owner's_Manual-2013&2014-Release1.05(web%20version).pdf

We like chain drive for a few reasons:

1. It's simple and very efficient.  I believe a properly lubricated and tensioned chain can provide nearly 99% efficiency in power transmission.
2. The chain, counter-shaft sprocket, and rear wheel sprocket (chain-wheel for those in the UK) are less expensive and require less packaging space than the comparable belt components.
3. A chain can be broken for replacement, so it is not necessary to provide a break in the swingarm or other mechanical structure to remove a belt.
4. It is easier to change final drive gearing with aftermarket sprockets.  This is extremely helpful for anyone interested in racing the bikes as the final gearing will vary based on track. 
5. A belt requires perfect concentricity between the motor countershaft and the rear suspension pivot or a pulley system (as Buell uses) to avoid stretching and compression during suspension travel.  This can sometimes be a constraint that is difficult to package around or forces a trade-off that you'd rather not make. 
6. A belt is susceptible to shredding from rocks and road debris, so you need to cover more of it with plastic shrouding to prevent this from happening.  More parts = more cost.

Overall, I'm not against belts.  I appreciate that they provide lower maintenance and noise. It just did not seem like the appropriate solution for the Empulse.   
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Lectric Bill

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2014, 01:19:29 AM »

Another Empulse rider's experience...

I've put 15K miles on since 12/2012, riding the 3rd Empulse delivered to San Francisco.

As an Early Adopter, here's my service history:

After a big rain, early on, there was a fault code. Brammo asked me to email them the data recorded on the onboard memory stick. They determined there was moisture in a battery case that should not be there. Response: They sent a truck to pick up my bike on a Monday, returning it to the factory. They had the dealer give me a demo Empulse to ride. They made changes to the battery case design, replaced all 7 of my batteries and had my bike back in my hands by Friday, same week. No problem with the new batteries.

After riding daily over San Francisco's infamous potholes, I noticed a crack in the steel taillight mounting bracket and suggested to them that it needed to be redesigned to prevent metal fatigue. They had their dealer give me an instant replacement and ship mine back to the factory. After a short study, they recalled the existing brackets and had their dealers replace with a new design under warranty. No problem with the new tailpiece.

I had a small amount of oil seeping from a seal around the transmission shifter shaft. Brammo wanted to examine the entire transmission, so, under warranty, they had my local dealer replace it with a new one and ship mine back to the factory. No leaks since.

After a heavy rainstorm, my throttle grip stopped functioning properly: no go until twisted quite a bit, and then sudden high torque. I rode the bike (VERY CAREFULLY!) to my dealer who called Brammo. They had no instances of this, even in Oregon, which is pretty much under water most of the time! Solution: open the grip switch, blow it out, spray it with WD40. On my own, I later put a piece of black electrical tape over the top of the switch where there's a seam. No problem since.

There's been an occasional fault code that shuts down the bike when accelerating very hard over a series of quick bumps. Apparently the bike's brain senses that the rear wheel is spinning freely and shuts things down. Solution: turn key off, back on to reset. This has happened to me 3 times in 15K miles.

The motor, controller, BMS, charger, brakes, chain, and 12V electrical components have all functioned perfectly.

I change the tranny oil every 3K miles, just enough to remind me that I enjoy "wrenching," at least for the 15 minutes it takes me. Gotta get SOME use out of my fancy torque wrench!

In summary: I'd buy another in a New York second. Most fun I've had with my clothes on.
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oregonrider89

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Re: Empulse reliability
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2014, 01:13:07 AM »

Lectric Bill.

Thank you for that honest and thorough review.

Nothing in your report scared me off of Brammo. In fact, their response to the problems you encountered indicates to me that they are providing excellent customer service which encourages me to keep them at the top of the short list.

I really like the level 2 charging feature and I already have a Blink membership for when I buy. Soon, very soon.
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