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Author Topic: F A S T C O M P A C T CHARGER 1 hour 7.5kW for ZERO!  (Read 11095 times)

Doctorbass

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F A S T C O M P A C T CHARGER 1 hour 7.5kW for ZERO!
« on: July 29, 2013, 09:34:09 AM »

Yes.. Doc got the power! ;)

I received the 3 meanwell 2500W power supply today. these are rated 2000W but the have their constant current at 125% so it'S 2500W continuous

-Total weight: 12 pounds
-Work on 100 to 240Vac
-3 of these( 7500W) have less volume than a single 1000W deltaQ !!

I also have installed a Anderson connector on the Sevcon controller to charge at high current (100A DC)
and bought some 250V 50A LEVITON AC socket and plug and a 40A double pole breaker to add to my garage subpannel

Guys this is really incredible how compact and powerfull this charger will be !!


These meanwell power supply will draw a total of 36.5A MAX at 240V according to their rating so all the LEVEL II   J1772 charging station should take that easy with a 40A EVSE.

Here is how i will connect them.

2 of the RSP-2000-48 (42A) connected in parallel to get 48V 84A (105A max)
in serie with 1 RSP-2000-24 (80A or 100A max)

To get 75V at 100A ( the rsp-2000-24) will be adjusted to 27V ( 48 + 27 = 75V)

Today i did 105km with my ZF9 on a road with  some beautifull mountain landscape and i measured 6400Wh used (89Ah)  and (the ZF9 have 7900Wh energy rating) and the last 2 bar was flashing on the gauge.

This mean that if i charge at 7500W  of power to fill the 6400Wh used it shoud take about 6400/7500= 52 minutes !

I will also use the charge enable signal connection that the quick charge plug have and will connect it to a relay that will activate or desactivate the power on the power supply to stop the charging current when the battery is full and  to protect it against cell bank overcahrge.

The 3 power supply cost 1300$ shipped wich is 300$ cheaper than the PFC 5000W Elcon charger without shipping !... and... 2500W more powerfull !

Also what is great is that these can also be connected all in serie and adjusted to get he 116V for the 2013  Zero;)

here is some porn pics for you guys: ( SOON... my slow samsung smartphone need to upload pics ::))

Doc

Here is the video ( sorry in French)















« Last Edit: July 09, 2015, 11:21:39 AM by Doctorbass »
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protomech

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2013, 09:58:50 AM »

Hi Doc,

Are the power supplies configured to finish the charge with constant voltage? Or do you constant current charge up to some voltage (say 4.1 volts per cell * 18 = 73.8V) with the power supplies, then use the stock onboard charger to finish the job?
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Doctorbass

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2013, 10:08:24 AM »

Hi Protomech

That's an Excellent Question

Yes these power supply are constant current and constant voltage. each of the RSP serie can be adjusted  from 40 to 115% of their rated voltage with a pot so yes they are constant VOLTAGE and as for the constant current, it's the overload protection set to 125% of the rated current that is active and make the constant current.
These are also constant power  so if the voltage is set to 115% then the max current drop a bit.

btw from my experience the Zero EIG cells are set by the BMS to 4.15V CV, just like the Emoli of the 2011 and previous battery.

My zero is showing 75.0V exactly when full ( Fluke calibrated Cycle analyst ;)  ) wich correspond to 4.166 V per cell

I have two choice for finishing the charge:  using the Onboard 1kW deltaQ that already finetine the balance function with the bms thru the white signal wire or to continu using meanwell and using the signal wire to the output enable input of the meanwell to  control the output rate tand keep the cells protected at  end of cahrge with the HVC

Doc



 
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Doctorbass

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2013, 10:13:02 AM »

some more pics 8)

As you can see the 3 meanwell are smaller volume than the deltaQ!!

You can also see the various AC current daw by one of the two 48V meanwell and related output current too.

finally a view of the cycle analyst i installed on my Zero with the nearly 90Ah used out of the 120 Ah rated ( note that the two remaining bar was flashing since about 5km)

I measured about 10km per bar average (also saw  9.5km per bar at 90km/h)

Doc
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Lipo423

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #4 on: July 29, 2013, 11:37:47 AM »

This looks very nice  ;)

Get an air conditioning system in your lab, The heat dissipation is going to be interesting  ;D
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trikester

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2013, 09:49:55 PM »

I'm wondering about the cooling of those supplies. I know that switching regulators are highly efficient (having been my business) but those look too good to be true. Do they each have a built in fan? Even then it looks to be marginal.

Doc, have you used them at full rated power and measured temperatures?

Trikester
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Doctorbass

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2013, 11:48:38 PM »

Doc, have you used them at full rated power and measured temperatures?

Trikester

Yes i have used them but it is the RSP-1000 version not the 2000.

Yes they have dual high speed fan that modulate with the power demand. i just not shown these in the pictures.

Here is a 1U x 3 unit module where you can see the high flow fan:


The RSP-1000 metal case was about 40 celsius average on the surface at about 1250W max continuous output. I used a IR thermometer and a black tape on the surface ( metalic surface reflect IR so the black tape is a great " black body" surface to point the IR thermometer on.

Doc

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BSDThw

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2013, 03:09:02 AM »

Hi Doc,

Can't wait to see how it works, Funny yesterday I was thinking about the SNT RSP-750-48 / 24 MeanWell, because I had to order other stuff and saw this one at the disti. But the 24V type are not available at the moment. They have Voltage and Current adjustable what I liked because you can reduce Grid Load if necessary! 

Why did you use 48V + 24V and not 3 * 24V (and maybe a 4th when using for the 2013)?

When you go to the Battery / Sevcon connection is the main relay on while loading, or do you switch it separately? I hear always a relay clicking but I thought it is the Delta-Q.

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Lipo423

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2013, 03:11:20 AM »

In line -in a way- with Trikester...I would definitely monitor the temp, if at any moment one of the fans fails you have got a problem...I'm also familiar with switching technology but the output power is pretty high anyway. For a few bucks, you can get a temp display...just in case.

This business reminds me (not saying this is the case) when Intel launched the 60 MHz (yes, MHz, not GHz) Pentium Processors, and had huge thermal problems and function failures.
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2014 Zero SR 11.4, BMW C1 125, BMW R 850R

Doctorbass

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2013, 03:42:28 AM »

Hi Doc,

Can't wait to see how it works, Funny yesterday I was thinking about the SNT RSP-750-48 / 24 MeanWell, because I had to order other stuff and saw this one at the disti. But the 24V type are not available at the moment. They have Voltage and Current adjustable what I liked because you can reduce Grid Load if necessary! 

Why did you use 48V + 24V and not 3 * 24V (and maybe a 4th when using for the 2013)?

When you go to the Battery / Sevcon connection is the main relay on while loading, or do you switch it separately? I hear always a relay clicking but I thought it is the Delta-Q.

That's interesting to see Meanwell also make some current adjustable model, thanks.

what i like with the RSP-2000 si how compact they are! 21.7W per cu inch!!
I choosed to get two 48V model and one 24V because i can also use it for my ebikes and just bring one of these. otherwise for 48V i would have needed to bring 2 of them with me ;)
For the motorcycle in both case i can only have 3 to get 7500W. and for the 2013 i could use all them in serie to get max 141V at 50A ( 56+56+29V)  wich is excellent too i think

Doc
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Doctorbass

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2013, 03:44:34 AM »

In line -in a way- with Trikester...I would definitely monitor the temp, if at any moment one of the fans fails you have got a problem...I'm also familiar with switching technology but the output power is pretty high anyway. For a few bucks, you can get a temp display...just in case.

This business reminds me (not saying this is the case) when Intel launched the 60 MHz (yes, MHz, not GHz) Pentium Processors, and had huge thermal problems and function failures.

Yes that's a great care to have and i'll probably do but i had great succes with the RSP-1000. Their fan blow alot of air! I will also install a hig amp shottky diode in paralle with each meanwell in serie to protect them in case the power on delay is not all the same on the 3 power supply. this will protect against reeverse voltage.

Doc
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eyeinsky

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Re: ZF9 battery < 1 hour 7.5kW F A S T charger !
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2013, 06:47:06 AM »

Good work, Nice project very useful for these larger KW bikes

 ;D

 
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Doctorbass

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Re: F A S T CHARGER 1 hour 7.5kW for ZERO!
« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2013, 10:26:03 AM »

UPDATE: 4 august 2013

Charger fully assembled and 100% working !!

It is exactly like i predicted and draw 30A max so it is compativle with the J1772 30A Level II standard (I also have  my J1772 Adapter and pilot signal circuit board are in the mail)

The charger is limiting the current to 90A DC wich is perfect and is giving 6.1kW when battery is fully discharged and raise to 6.6kW when battery is full, but i stop before to not overcahrge. i prefer charging to 95% during long ride and  sometime, at home to let the last 5% for finetuning the cell balance last stage done with the stock deltaQ at lower current occasionally.

From now i have to leave teh bike ON for charging because i need the internal contactor to be ON, but once i have time i will remove the battery and relocate the connections directly BEFORE the contactor. I will also add the Stop charging signal of the zero BMS to control teh charger to 100% protect the battery.

I prepared a great video for you  and couples of pictures as well ;)

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WindRider

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Re: F A S T CHARGER 1 hour 7.5kW for ZERO!
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2013, 11:13:06 AM »

Nice work Doc.   If you are carrying this charger on board make sure you keep your speed < 88 MPH.   

 ;D

It looks like you can no go after Terry's touring records.   This is the perfect quick charge solution for traveling by E Bike.   
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protomech

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Re: F A S T CHARGER 1 hour 7.5kW for ZERO!
« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2013, 06:44:57 PM »

Here's the link for the video.



The tradeoff for high power density is the fan noise you hear when the chargers are plugged in. That's much less of a problem if plugged in at a garage, but is less than ideal for public charging.

Still, if you're already wearing earplugs from riding, it's probably not that bad : P

Doc, do you know what is the temperature rise for the power supplies? Ex if 10C outside, the power supplies climb to 70C? I assume they self-restrict at a certain temperature..
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