ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Other Electric Motorcycles => Topic started by: JaimeC on June 10, 2017, 02:58:19 AM
-
I had a chance to demo this beast today at Americade. From a quick walk around compared to my C650GT scooter it has far less storage capacity. The majority of the underseat area is the massive battery pack. I was informed it is two cells from the BMW i3 electric automobile. The passenger seat lifts up and has a storage area big enough to hold one full face helmet. HOWEVER the BMW rep said that if you carry the charging cables in there, there won't be enough room for a full face helmet (perhaps a 3/4 would fit?).
What looks like two glove boxes on either side of the fairing is deceptive. Only the right side cover hides a storage area. The left side covers up the J1772 charging port.
The low windshield is non-adjustable. It keeps the majority of the wind off of your chest to reduce fatigue but your head is completely in the airflow. I'm 5'10" and there was no buffeting, it was essentially "clean" airflow.
The riding position is more reminiscent of the Yamaha TMAX than the C650GT. I could not straighten out my legs for a stretch like I can on the C650GT, or as I was able on the C650 Sport. The passenger has fold-away foot pegs, not a running board like the GT scooter.
Now comes the part most of you will be interested in hearing. Starting the scooter is reminiscent of the Victory Empulse TT. Besides turning the key, you have to hold in the brake and press the "Start" button. I have NO idea why they feel this is necessary but there you have it. Once you press the "Start" button a whole array of displays appears on the front dash panels. It has several driving modes. "Dynamic" was full power and full regen. Compared to the Zero S, the full regen felt like you dropped an anchor. It really does slow the scooter down, and not gently either. I switched it into "Road" mode and that felt more like my "Custom" setting on the Zero S. They also have a mode called "Sail" which has no regen at all... cutting the throttle just causes the bike to coast like a 600 lbs bicycle. There is also an "Eco" mode but I didn't try that so I don't know how it feels. It looks like it provides full regen and limits your top end power.
As for that power: If you have an "R" model Zero you'll know what I'm talking about. This thing pulls like a FREIGHT TRAIN right on the get-go. I was seriously impressed by that, let me tell you! Despite the weight, it handled very well as all the weight is carried very low.
The BMW reps said they're not sure when it'll go on sale in the United States, or how much they'd charge for it. They told me in Europe their biggest customers were not individual buyers but corporate fleet orders. So I don't know when you might see these in the dealerships. It was nice, but I'm more than happy with my Zero S.
-
Was it the LR version, or the original model? The LR comes with a very tall, optional, windshield. I'm quite tall, and compared to the initial model, the LR's tall windshield is perfect. No wind, no buffeting and I can ride with visor open.
Almost all C's here are fitted with a matching topcase, and indeed the under-seat area has all the charging cables, and in my case a rain outfit.
The range is what makes the LR interesting. Last week I did a record; 180 km on a single charge, but it did require some eco riding.
Glad you liked it. BTW, I heard the LR is coming to the USA...
-
I have no idea what model it was, all they said was it was the "C-Evolution." There was no top box, and the windshield was rather short.
-
If the scoot was white, it's the oldmmodel, grey is the new model.
-
If the scoot was white, it's the oldmmodel, grey is the new model.
According to the tag on the key, it said "2018." Here's a photo I snapped Monday morning: http://tinyurl.com/y9faybwh (http://tinyurl.com/y9faybwh)
-
That is indeed the latest model, the Long Range model.
-
Here is a short review of the C Evolution by Motorcycle.com. Nothing new, though. But when they finally get to test ride one, it should be interesting as they plan to hammer the scooter and when they do that, I bet it won't get 99 miles from its battery pack :) : http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/bmw/2018-bmw-c-evolution-scooter.html
-
I spoke with the owner of CalMoto in Mountain View, CA, today. He told me that one C-Evolution scooter should be arriving at their shop in a couple of weeks. He mentioned that not every shop will be getting even one and they will need to be special ordered, like is done with Zeros. I gathered that test rides of the scooter would not be offered. You will have to close your eyes, cross your fingers, and pay for the bike without a test ride. He also mentioned that the shop needed to purchase $30K worth of special equipment to work on the C-Evolution and it was likely that there would be only one shop in the SF Bay Area that would have this equipment and it would be shared by other shops. He also mentioned that their technicians were being trained to work on the scooter and that they would not be working on the power train, electronics or battery systems. Mostly just the chassis. Any major systems work that might need to be performed would be done at a central BMW service center located somewhere in the state. I got the feeling that this location had not yet been established.
-
Hello All-
My name is Moshe K. Levy, and I'm a contributing columnist for Motorcycle Consumer News, BMW Owner's News, Rider, On The Level, Thunder Press, and a few other magazines. I learned of this forum from a member here, because a few weeks ago I was given the very first press BMW C-Evolution to review on behalf of Motorcycle Consumer News. The article will be out in the January 2018 issue, and the video version is here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Efm0wUDbHKM
I'd really be interested in getting my hands on a Zero to test on the same "Commuter Cycle" type program I just put the C-Evo through. I think our readership would like to learn about a true electric motorcycle, in addition to the scooter. The issue is, I'm in NJ, and I think most of Zero's fleet is in CA. If anyone has any reach within Zero, please let me know because I think an east coast test, especially in fall, would serve to put many of the misconceptions at rest. Thanks!
-Moshe
-
Moshe, Motorcycle Consumer News tested the Zero SR in their September 2014 issue. While the suspension and brakes have been improved since then, the basic level of performance has stayed pretty much the same (maybe a 10% increase). If you haven't read that review yet, you might want to check it out. I think you will find that Zero's range predictions for the government's city EV cycle is pretty accurate. In any case, if there is a Zero dealer near you, they usually have at least one demonstrator that you could likely borrow for a day of testing. Also, I am sure that MCN has connections with Zero as they have tested three of their models in the past. It is likely that they could work out some sort of 2017 loaner for you to test, supplied by a local dealer. But if you want to test a 2018 model, that may be a little more difficult as I don't think the new bikes are being shipped out to dealers yet.
-
Moshe, Motorcycle Consumer News tested the Zero SR in their September 2014 issue. While the suspension and brakes have been improved since then, the basic level of performance has stayed pretty much the same (maybe a 10% increase). If you haven't read that review yet, you might want to check it out. I think you will find that Zero's range predictions for the government's city EV cycle is pretty accurate. In any case, if there is a Zero dealer near you, they usually have at least one demonstrator that you could likely borrow for a day of testing. Also, I am sure that MCN has connections with Zero as they have tested three of their models in the past. It is likely that they could work out some sort of 2017 loaner for you to test, supplied by a local dealer. But if you want to test a 2018 model, that may be a little more difficult as I don't think the new bikes are being shipped out to dealers yet.
A few years back when I was still writing motorcycle stuff, Zero France loaned me a brand new Zero DS for a month. I contacted their PR agency, and 2 weeks later the bike was in my garage.
-
Yes, I remember that 2014 test. That was more a road test. What I wanted to do was outfit a Zero for commuting duty - bags and shield and such - and then use it on my commute for a season or so, and then compare the experience and cost to my usual commuter (BMW R1200RT.) I think this would be interesting to readers. The editor of MCN and I have reached out to Zero a few times, but I don't think they have much fleet out here in NJ.
-MKL
-
Yes, I remember that 2014 test. That was more a road test. What I wanted to do was outfit a Zero for commuting duty - bags and shield and such - and then use it on my commute for a season or so, and then compare the experience and cost to my usual commuter (BMW R1200RT.) I think this would be interesting to readers. The editor of MCN and I have reached out to Zero a few times, but I don't think they have much fleet out here in NJ.
-MKL
Good luck with that request. ::) Zero demonstrators seem to be few and far between. If you want to obtain a Zero for a long-term ride I suspect that you will have to buy one - although Aerostitch got an FX for an entire winter. But something like that doesn't happen very often. ;) And Aerostitch did publish a book about that experience, which Zero was passing out during their 10th anniversary factory open house last year. So they got some good press with that winter loan.
-
Indeed, it may be difficult. But if I were in Zero Marketing's shoes, I'd strongly consider it. Testing range in Southern California's perfect weather isn't exactly a realistic environment for most of the rest of the country.
-MKL
-
Indeed, it may be difficult. But if I were in Zero Marketing's shoes, I'd strongly consider it. Testing range in Southern California's perfect weather isn't exactly a realistic environment for most of the rest of the country.
-MKL
Personally, I am not convinced that Zero has much of a marketing department. Most of their marketing seems to be via posting videos and ads on the internet. Anything physical, that can't be accomplished with a push of a button, seems to happen (very) infrequently.
-
Perhaps. I'm always available should they come a knockin'! ;)
-MKL, (MBA Marketing, New York University, 2005)
-
Ok,
I'm moving the discussion over in Harley LiveWire that has ensued over a disclaimer I wrote regarding my doubts about any manufacture releasing new EV's until Solid State batteries come out in the next few years with the exception of BMW.
Here's a link to the discussion....
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=6465.msg62677#new
I still maintain that BMW is still in the process of introducing this product.
Yes it's been brought to market here in California but it's not a forgone conclusion that it will be fully introduced here in the US.
"The C evolution will initially be introduced in the U.S. as part of a pilot program and will only be available in California at the time of launch. As interest in the C evolution builds, BMW Motorrad USA will expand this product offering to BMW Motorrad retailers in other states."
http://blog.motorcycle.com/2017/07/31/manufacturers/bmw/2017-bmw-c-evolution-electric-scooter-launching-california/
So it sounds to me that BMW is taking a wait & see approach to this vehical & thus this process that I stated is yet over.
P.S.
Moderators, isn't it time BMW had its own sub-forum?
-
It is a shipping product in Europe. They are judging the market here in the States. That is a PRODUCTION VEHICLE by any definition of the word.
Peugeot automobiles are only available in Europe and have been in production for DECADES but by your definition, they aren't real production vehicles because they aren't sold in the States. The Livewire, by contrast, is a prototype that isn't available ANYWHERE for sale. THAT is the difference.
-
Never stated it's not in production (the BMW).
It's the LiveWire that will not be produced until next generation battery allows it to make sense (lower price, faster charge, & greater range).
"I have to think it will not be produced until solid state battery's come out which is still a few years out.
These battery's will significantly increase range, lower charge time, & likely cost less then present battery's.
With this new technology so close to being available, I dought you will see many if any mainstream manufacturers release new EV products.
That said, BMW is in the process of releasing an electric scooter.
Good things come to those that wait......."
I think the mistake I made (in my original statement) was in an attempt to fortify this.....
"With this new technology so close to being available, I dought you will see many if any mainstream manufacturers release new EV products."
I didn't want someone to respond that I was wrong because BMW is bringing a EV to the US market.
Where I was in err was in labeling the C-Evolution as new.
The fact that it is an older release reinforces my statement regarding no manufacture is likely to release any new EV until the next gen battery is available (including Harley Davidson).
-
I find it a little odd that this forum has a section for the Harley Livewire, which was and still is a pure concept/prototype vehicle, and yet nothing for the BMW C-Evolution which is an actual production vehicle that has been available in Europe for a few years already and is now entering the United States. Based on posts I've read, not everyone here lives in the USA either... so what gives??
-
... so what gives??
My guess, two things.
1) It ain't a Harley.
2) It's a scooter.
Biased and/or prejudiced? Yeah, prolly.
-
I find it a little odd that this forum has a section for the Harley Livewire, which was and still is a pure concept/prototype vehicle, and yet nothing for the BMW C-Evolution which is an actual production vehicle that has been available in Europe for a few years already and is now entering the United States. Based on posts I've read, not everyone here lives in the USA either... so what gives??
There was a time not long ago that the Harley was being hyped like it was a real thing, ready to go... thats when they made the sub forum.
There are millions of electric scooters and tens of millions of electric bicycles... as most are not "motorcycles" they are not mentioned often on the "electric motorcycle" forum. You can always ask for an exception of course. I dont think theres any hate, just not everyone is aware of the scooter options.
-
It has always pissed me off the way "motorcycles" are seen different from scooters. Technically and legally, they are all motorcycles. That's like saying a cruiser is not a motorcycle. Or a enduro is not one.
I'd say almost anywhere in the world, you use the same license to ride either. Riding a scooter puts you in the same risks as other bikes.
But still, many see scooters are not-motorcycles and beneath them.
Pity
-
It has always pissed me off the way "motorcycles" are seen different from scooters. Technically and legally, they are all motorcycles. That's like saying a cruiser is not a motorcycle. Or a enduro is not one.
I'd say almost anywhere in the world, you use the same license to ride either. Riding a scooter puts you in the same risks as other bikes.
But still, many see scooters are not-motorcycles and beneath them.
Pity
True. I rode a Silverwing for a while. Hours in the saddle, 100mph+ cruising on the interstate. All the motorcycle cred you could get.
Sent from my Z982 using Tapatalk
-
It has always pissed me off the way "motorcycles" are seen different from scooters. Technically and legally, they are all motorcycles. That's like saying a cruiser is not a motorcycle. Or a enduro is not one.
I'd say almost anywhere in the world, you use the same license to ride either. Riding a scooter puts you in the same risks as other bikes.
But still, many see scooters are not-motorcycles and beneath them.
Pity
Actually it depends on the scooter and where you live.
Here, Technically and legally, most scooters are NOT motorcycles. They fall under mopeds, require no license or insurance. They're known as DUI rides because they're your only choice once you lose your license.
They are all under 50cc, no gears, 4hp or so.. and looked down upon.
On the otherhand, elsewhere in the world you have silverwings and other mega-scooters more common... they're comfortable motorcycles that you happen to step though. The step through part defines them as a scooter, but legally and objectively they are motorcycles.
I have no problem with mopeds or scooters.. I just draw the distinction at being step through or not... and I kind of ignore the low power ones as they are very limited as transportation when your country is connected via interstate travel. US highways have a horsepower minimum.
-
Sure, mopeds are mopeds and don't require a special license. I don't think we're talking about those. Silverwings, MP3, any scooter over 125cc usually requires a motorcycle license, and IMHO should be seen as a motorcycle.
We're now getting to the point that some scoots and more like "normal" bikes. Take the latest Honda Adv-Scoot.... it's a traditional scoot (ie no gear changing, etc) but looks a lot like a bike.
-
Sure, mopeds are mopeds and don't require a special license. I don't think we're talking about those. Silverwings, MP3, any scooter over 125cc usually requires a motorcycle license, and IMHO should be seen as a motorcycle.
We're now getting to the point that some scoots and more like "normal" bikes. Take the latest Honda Adv-Scoot.... it's a traditional scoot (ie no gear changing, etc) but looks a lot like a bike.
But they dont sell those here.
The very few non-moped-scooters they sell here are either for people illegally running them as mopeds, or a few eccentric people. There are no common non-moped scooters in most of the United States.
-
Beg to differ...
Piaggio sell a whole range of MP3 http://www.piaggiousa.com/ (http://www.piaggiousa.com/)
BMW sell their 650 cc scoots http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html (http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html)
Suzuki sell their Burgman http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx (http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx)
even the Honda Silverwing (but not the updated model) http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx (http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx)
It's just they are not sold in the numbers they are sold in Europe, where there are more scoots (mostly because of business folks using them to bypass traffic).
-
Beg to differ...
Piaggio sell a whole range of MP3 http://www.piaggiousa.com/ (http://www.piaggiousa.com/)
BMW sell their 650 cc scoots http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html (http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html)
Suzuki sell their Burgman http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx (http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx)
even the Honda Silverwing (but not the updated model) http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx (http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx)
It's just they are not sold in the numbers they are sold in Europe, where there are more scoots (mostly because of business folks using them to bypass traffic).
hmm lets see.. does that conflict with what I just said?
a few eccentric people. There are no common non-moped scooters in most of the United States.
nope.
You can literally go weeks or even years without seeing a single non-moped scooter in the majority of the USA.
Dont get me wrong, I like high power scooters. I even worked at a scooter shop that specialized in modding Vespas ... but they are not anywhere close to common. You'll see more Zeros on the road then Piaggios, BMW scoots and Silverwings combined. Im not sure if they still have it, but my local Honda motorcycle dealership still had a new, never sold 2014 silverwing earlier this year (2017). In 2008 they picked up Kymco and sold a ton of 125 and 150cc scooters as mopeds, until the DMV shut it down. they couldnt support selling the brand on just 50cc ones, even in 2009 when the economy was not doing so well and mopeds were becoming more acceptable for college kids.
There are places in the world different than where you live.
-
Beg to differ...
Piaggio sell a whole range of MP3 http://www.piaggiousa.com/ (http://www.piaggiousa.com/)
BMW sell their 650 cc scoots http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html (http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html)
Suzuki sell their Burgman http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx (http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx)
even the Honda Silverwing (but not the updated model) http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx (http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx)
It's just they are not sold in the numbers they are sold in Europe, where there are more scoots (mostly because of business folks using them to bypass traffic).
hmm lets see.. does that conflict with what I just said?
a few eccentric people. There are no common non-moped scooters in most of the United States.
nope.
You can literally go weeks or even years without seeing a single non-moped scooter in the majority of the USA.
Dont get me wrong, I like high power scooters. I even worked at a scooter shop that specialized in modding Vespas ... but they are not anywhere close to common. You'll see more Zeros on the road then Piaggios, BMW scoots and Silverwings combined. Im not sure if they still have it, but my local Honda motorcycle dealership still had a new, never sold 2014 silverwing earlier this year (2017). In 2008 they picked up Kymco and sold a ton of 125 and 150cc scooters as mopeds, until the DMV shut it down. they couldnt support selling the brand on just 50cc ones, even in 2009 when the economy was not doing so well and mopeds were becoming more acceptable for college kids.
There are places in the world different than where you live.
I see a LOT more BMW scooters and Burgmans than I do Zeros here. In fact, in the year and a half that I've had my Zero, I'm the ONLY one I've actually seen on the road and I commute every day with it. I've seen one or two in for service when I'm at the shop, but I've never actually seen them on the road.
-
Beg to differ...
Piaggio sell a whole range of MP3 http://www.piaggiousa.com/ (http://www.piaggiousa.com/)
BMW sell their 650 cc scoots http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html (http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html)
Suzuki sell their Burgman http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx (http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx)
even the Honda Silverwing (but not the updated model) http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx (http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx)
It's just they are not sold in the numbers they are sold in Europe, where there are more scoots (mostly because of business folks using them to bypass traffic).
hmm lets see.. does that conflict with what I just said?
a few eccentric people. There are no common non-moped scooters in most of the United States.
nope.
You can literally go weeks or even years without seeing a single non-moped scooter in the majority of the USA.
Dont get me wrong, I like high power scooters. I even worked at a scooter shop that specialized in modding Vespas ... but they are not anywhere close to common. You'll see more Zeros on the road then Piaggios, BMW scoots and Silverwings combined. Im not sure if they still have it, but my local Honda motorcycle dealership still had a new, never sold 2014 silverwing earlier this year (2017). In 2008 they picked up Kymco and sold a ton of 125 and 150cc scooters as mopeds, until the DMV shut it down. they couldnt support selling the brand on just 50cc ones, even in 2009 when the economy was not doing so well and mopeds were becoming more acceptable for college kids.
There are places in the world different than where you live.
I see a LOT more BMW scooters and Burgmans than I do Zeros here. In fact, in the year and a half that I've had my Zero, I'm the ONLY one I've actually seen on the road and I commute every day with it. I've seen one or two in for service when I'm at the shop, but I've never actually seen them on the road.
Yup. I've seen my Zero and one other in Denver. Many more super scooters.
And don't forget, many motorcycle licensed scooters look just like the 49cc's but just have bigger motors. One of my co-workers has what looks like a "moped" scooter but got herself a speeding ticket for doing 85mph.
As far as DUI, in Colorado (and many other states) riding a "moped" requires a driver's license. And a license suspension revokes your privilege to operate any vehicle on the roadway. In the wilds of the Jersey pine barrens many think they can drive their ATVs (to the liquor store) after losing their license. That'll just get you a ticket for operating an illegal, unregistered vehicle ... Without a license.
Sent from my Z982 using Tapatalk
-
Beg to differ...
Piaggio sell a whole range of MP3 http://www.piaggiousa.com/ (http://www.piaggiousa.com/)
BMW sell their 650 cc scoots http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html (http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/fascination/worldoverview/urban_mobility/main.html)
Suzuki sell their Burgman http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx (http://www.suzukicycles.com/Product%20Lines/Scooters.aspx)
even the Honda Silverwing (but not the updated model) http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx (http://powersports.honda.com/2013/silver-wing-abs.aspx)
It's just they are not sold in the numbers they are sold in Europe, where there are more scoots (mostly because of business folks using them to bypass traffic).
hmm lets see.. does that conflict with what I just said?
a few eccentric people. There are no common non-moped scooters in most of the United States.
nope.
You can literally go weeks or even years without seeing a single non-moped scooter in the majority of the USA.
Dont get me wrong, I like high power scooters. I even worked at a scooter shop that specialized in modding Vespas ... but they are not anywhere close to common. You'll see more Zeros on the road then Piaggios, BMW scoots and Silverwings combined. Im not sure if they still have it, but my local Honda motorcycle dealership still had a new, never sold 2014 silverwing earlier this year (2017). In 2008 they picked up Kymco and sold a ton of 125 and 150cc scooters as mopeds, until the DMV shut it down. they couldnt support selling the brand on just 50cc ones, even in 2009 when the economy was not doing so well and mopeds were becoming more acceptable for college kids.
There are places in the world different than where you live.
I see a LOT more BMW scooters and Burgmans than I do Zeros here. In fact, in the year and a half that I've had my Zero, I'm the ONLY one I've actually seen on the road and I commute every day with it. I've seen one or two in for service when I'm at the shop, but I've never actually seen them on the road.
Yup. I've seen my Zero and one other in Denver. Many more super scooters.
And don't forget, many motorcycle licensed scooters look just like the 49cc's but just have bigger motors. One of my co-workers has what looks like a "moped" scooter but got herself a speeding ticket for doing 85mph.
As far as DUI, in Colorado (and many other states) riding a "moped" requires a driver's license. And a license suspension revokes your privilege to operate any vehicle on the roadway. In the wilds of the Jersey pine barrens many think they can drive their ATVs (to the liquor store) after losing their license. That'll just get you a ticket for operating an illegal, unregistered vehicle ... Without a license.
Sent from my Z982 using Tapatalk
But Colorado is cool in that you CAN register the ATV (with a couple mods) as a highway vehicle.
-
Today I visited my BMW dealer and saw my first C-Evolution scooter in person. I was very impressed by its design and excellent manufacturing quality. The scooter on the showroom floor was already sold. BMW has got to be loosing their shirt on every one they sell at a price of only $14,000 USD. Photo attached. Note the Energica motorcycles in the background of the picture. While I was there, a fellow took a test ride of an Eva. While he looked like he had fun riding the bike, I didn't see him spend any time at the salesman's desk. ;)
-
Here is another review of the C-Evolution: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=93&v=1J28A9N8pnE
-
Motorcycle Consumer News has published a four-page review of the C-Evolution in their January 2018 issue. A few things in the article caught my eye:
The motor is said to produce 48 hp and 53 lb.-ft. of torque, "from 0 rpm to 4500 rpm", however the power curve chart included with the article shows the power being produced is 44 kW at 7,500 rpm and torque as 63 Nm at 6,000 rpm. I get the feeling that may be the chart for BMW's C650GT IC scooter.
The article states that its regen can increase the scooter's range by 10 to 20%. Frankly, I find that statement hard to believe. In my personal experience, after owing 5 electric motorcycles, it is more like 1 to 3%.
Acceleration to 30 is said to take 3 seconds and to 60 mph, 7 seconds. No quarter-mile performance was provided. Top speed is electronically limited to 80 mph.
The bike is powered by 36 Samsung SDI li-ion cells (133V nominal), with a total capacity of 12.5 kWh (nominal?). Advertised range is 99 mph in Eco Pro mode. The reviewer said that they were able to obtain 9.8 miles per kWh while riding "assertively" in the city and 11 miles per kWh while "babying" it in city riding. "In a worst-case test, with the throttle pinned for 46 miles, it still returned an astonishing 4.9 miles per kWh, and that was in cool weather." (That calculates to 61 miles for the 12.5 kWh battery capacity.) The scooter will travel about 3.7 miles after its display shows that the pack is depleted.
In addition to ABS, the scooter has traction control to prevent rear wheel spinning under slippery conditions.
The scooter has an on-board level 2 charger that connects to a J1772 charging receptacle and also a separate 120VAC charger, so that the bike can be charged from a home wall outlet. Charging times are 9 hours, 20 minutes at 120V, or 4 hours, 30 minutes using the 3kW, 240V system.
The C-Evolution's 12 volt systems are powered by a separate 12V, 8Ah battery, rather than a DC-DC converter.
Suspension travel is 4.7 inches front and 4.5 inches in the rear.
What really got my attention is the weight of the scooter. 606 pounds, fully charged. :o That is 31 pounds more than BMW's IC scooters.
Seat height is 30.1 inches with the standard seat and 30.9 inches if you are sitting on the "comfort" seat.
There is a storage area under the passenger seat that can hold one full face helmet - once you remove the 12V charger stored there.
An accessory "touring" windshield is available - no doubt at a substantial extra cost, based upon my BMW buying experience. ::)
The color TFT instrument display is 7.25 inches wide by 3 inches high. (Isn't it about time that Zero changed their display to a color TFT, also?)
An interesting chart was included in the article comparing the cost of riding a C-Evolution and a BMW C650GT for 12,000 miles, based upon $130 per hour labor cost (which is what I pay at my BMW dealer). Here is the breakdown:
C-Evolution: 7.7 MPkWh, at $0.09 per kWh (about half of what I pay) = $140.26. Maintenance costs = $455, for a total of $490.26.
C650GT: 51.3 MPG at $2.85 (I pay 50 cents more per gallon) = $666.66. Maintenance costs = $1,716.00 (ouch!), for a total of $1,986.66.
-
This thing pulls like a FREIGHT TRAIN right on the get-go.
Not sure what that's meant to imply. Freight trains have tons of power, but very slow acceleration.
(BTW, I know that "tons" isn't actually a measure of power ;)
-
One thing that I forgot to praise the C-Evolution for is its parking brake that activates the brakes when the side stand is deployed. :)
-
One thing that I forgot to praise the C-Evolution for is its parking brake that activates the brakes when the side stand is deployed. :)
They have that on the ICE scooters too. I mentioned many times on this forum that I WISH Zero had adopted that same trick. It's great knowing that once I put down the sidestand on my C650GT, it isn't going ANYWHERE.
-
I stopped by my BMW dealer today and was told that they sold their first C-Evolution and their first Energica Eva, both bikes were shipped to buyers in Texas - of all places. ;) Apparently, Texans appreciate expensive electric motorcycles and scooters more than we do in the SF Bay Area. ???
-
If you like how it is made videos this one came up on youtube for me yesterday.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrE2Q4culaU
-
Not quite the way they do it at Zero. ;)
-
The C-Evolutions keep on coming to my local BMW dealer. But I was told that most sales are not local and they felt that was kind of strange, considering that they are located in the heart of Silicon Valley. Anyway, they have a demonstrator available if anyone wants to go for a test ride. ;)
-
The C-Evolution is not exactly jumping out of BMW showrooms, at least not in sunny and techy California. So far my dealer has only sold one and that was to a customer in Texas. I think BMW is really doing the best that they can to sell the scooter, with the very low price (for what you get in the way of thorough engineering and well-designed parts and assembly), but apparently large expensive scooters are just not much of a market thing in the U.S. They should have given electric motorcycles a try instead, like Energica. I think that would have been a better plan, at least here. ???
-
Agreed.... BMW makes very highly engineered motorcycles that are pretty much bomb proof.... Electric motorcycles are still a fairly difficult sale in the US of A.... They are relatively fragile, take to long to fuel and don't go the distance.... AND if you ask the average American cyclist about scooters, they will say they are for sissies !!!! Yep.... Beemer should have pulled out the stops and gone for a full bozo motorcycle.... The scooter may do alright in Europe, but it's just not the American way.... Yet !!!!
-
The article states that its regen can increase the scooter's range by 10 to 20%. Frankly, I find that statement hard to believe. In my personal experience, after owing 5 electric motorcycles, it is more like 1 to 3%.
Not sure about my Zeros or my Volt, but Three years with a Ford Focus Electric returned an AVERAGE of 20% added by regeneration. I hypermile at every opportunity so that may be the difference.
Many seem to put regen to maximum at all times. I keep it as mild as feasible other than maximum for braking. This way you don't have to accelerate again after letting off of the throttle when slowing down
-
The article states that its regen can increase the scooter's range by 10 to 20%. Frankly, I find that statement hard to believe. In my personal experience, after owing 5 electric motorcycles, it is more like 1 to 3%.
Not sure about my Zeros or my Volt, but Three years with a Ford Focus Electric returned an AVERAGE of 20% added by regeneration. I hypermile at every opportunity so that may be the difference.
Many seem to put regen to maximum at all times. I keep it as mild as feasible other than maximum for braking. This way you don't have to accelerate again after letting off of the throttle when slowing down
It has been my experience that electric motorcycles don't get much love from regen as a battery recharger. I think it works a lot better in a car, probably because cars weigh a lot more than a motorcycle and can overcome the regen drag much better. On my bikes, regen will slow the bike down quickly, resulting in little recharging time, compared with power consumption when traveling. Plus, regen tends to slow the bike down too much for the average road conditions, requiring the need to activate the throttle (and suck more power) to maintain a steady speed. I have my regen set for coasting with the throttle closed and that works best for me and I think it provides the most efficient use of battery power under most conditions.
-
I use full regen (100%) in my "Custom" mode. I use it primarily to save the brake pads more than anything else. I can either convert my forward speed into heat and black dust, or I could put some of that forward momentum back into the battery. Typically I can ride my favorite twisties without ever even touching the brakes.
Fun Trivia: Regen only kicks in when you roll the throttle off all the way to the stop. If you keep it from rolling all the way to the stop, you coast.
-
One thing I have noticed is that I have my custom program set to 100% regen when braking and that gives me more regen effect than does braking when having the bike in "eco" mode. So when I want to slow down I lightly touch the front brake, which activates the brake light and provides 100% regen drag but doesn't squeeze the brake pads until I need more braking and squeeze harder on the brake lever.
-
BTW, I was talking about the regen on my Zero. Based on my one road test of the BMW eScooter, full regen is like jamming on the rear brake hard. Damned near unridable at that setting... I definitely prefer the "full regen" setting on the Zero!
-
Actually, it's like driving the Nissan Leaf e-Pedal. You learn to let go of the throttle, bit-by-bit. Indeed, letting go fo the throttle is like hitting a brick wall. And BTW, when you do let go fast, the brake light goes on...
-
Here is another just published review of the 2018 BMW C Evolution, this one by Motorcycle.com:
http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/bmw/2018-bmw-c-evolution-review.html
-
I recently purchased a C Evolution from Long Beach BMW in California, and had it shipped up here to Seattle, WA. I am a long-time BMW aficionado having owned a half-dozen bikes and two cars over the last 20 years, including a 2013 C650GT. I am using it to commute to work in downtown Seattle and think that the C Evolution will be an improvement over the ICE scooter due to it's much lower operating costs. I have had no performance problems with the 20 miles of freeway and 10 miles of urban travel on my route (round trip) and have plenty of capacity for running various errands along the way. It's great for running up to the store or going on a little cruise in the evenings or on Saturday afternoon. Just like the C650GT was. I think the C Evo handles better - more planted and stable. Corners like on rails, and the fit and finish seems to be a little better. - the paint in particular. I have been charging it over night from a regular 120v circuit in my garage.
There are a bunch of reviews on the web that are pretty accurate. Moshe Levy's was instrumental in my decision to buy because he pointed out the operating cost costs of the C650 vs C Evolution. The motorcycle.com you tube comparison with a Zero SR (?) is also really good. Having owned the C650, I can point out some differences. Other than Heated grips and a Hella/BMW auxiliary power outlet (in the right fairing pocket) there are very few electrical doo-dads on th C Evo. No Tire Pressure Monitors, heated seats, or electro-mechanical lock releases. I have not (so far) actuated the ABS or Traction control but am glad to have them there to help me out when needed. One adjustment made was the purchase of a BMW Top box with the scooter because of the decrease in underseat storage. My favorite thing about it is that it's practically silent. I also like the way you can control speed as though the 'throttle' is a rheostat - rarely need to use the brakes except to hold position.
I have almost 500 miles on it now. My other bike is a 2016 BMW R1200GSA (Adventure-style bike) and it is a perfect complement to a scooter, particularly this one.
-
I wouldn't use the throttle to hold your scooter in place on a hill (if that is what you are doing). That is really tough on the motor as it heats it up and can lead to issues eventually if you do this long enough. Use the brakes to keep it from rolling backward and only use the throttle when taking off on a hill after releasing the brake.
-
I wouldn't use the throttle to hold your scooter in place on a hill (if that is what you are doing). That is really tough on the motor as it heats it up and can lead to issues eventually if you do this long enough. Use the brakes to keep it from rolling backward and only use the throttle when taking off on a hill after releasing the brake.
Or flick the sidestand which puts the parking brake on.
-
Mike and Richard - thanks for your comments but as stated, I mostly just use the brake to hold position. I'm sorry, but using the motor or the side stand for this purpose doesn't even make sense and I hope it's not something people think is a good idea, electric or internal combustion.