ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2012 and older => Topic started by: Electric Terry on May 31, 2012, 08:08:39 PM
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That's right, I'm now charging my 2012 Zero S ZF9 at 4kw!
(http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/224935_287007148061763_369143496_n.jpg)
Forgot how to do all the link stuff, hope that works! If those don't, I know this one does: http://www.facebook.com/lifeoffthegrid (http://www.facebook.com/lifeoffthegrid)
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Now that is what I call charging! ;D What did it take to get the juice from the meter to your bike? A backpack full of accessory chargers?
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The chargers are on the bike. Check out the facebook page above. And then a j1772 port and a bunch of 14 awg computer cords from a surplus store that I cut and soldered together. Each charger uses 208 volts and 5-6 amps, so running 20-24 amps total into the j1772 port.
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What did you need to do to generate a pilot signal for J1772 connector?
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Sweet :)
Will you use this setup regularly or just on longer rides?
I would like to get another off-board charger, but I don't know how I would hook them all up simoultaneously. The Chargepoint station that I used only had two outlets - a 120V and the J1772.
A Zero tech told me that I could plug both the regular charging cable and the J1772 at the same time, but then warned me that not all J1772 charging stations work with the Zero J1772 adapter. Decisions...
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Hi Terry,
cool modes and an interesting Facebook page.
I would like to build two charger like “Side Bags†so I can take the charger with my at a longer trip but remove it for normal use.
The company I work, is producing charger, so I can modify it for my need. But I have no idea what type the battery connector is.
I saw a picture of your bike with a bunch of cables.
Is this all original Zero Y-Cable stuff or did you built it.
Does anyone know what connector-type it is. Brand or datasheet?
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the connector is an Anderson connector. No signal is needed for the j1772 port, it has 5 connections, 3 like a recular 240 volt plug and 2 safetey connections that cut off current to the others if they aren't touching. made the rest of the connectors with computer cords and power pole connections before zero got anderson y connectors last week.
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Thanks for answering our questions.
I guess it is the Anderson SBS75XGRN (not 100% sure) but searching the NET I don't find a place to order in Germany. >:(
Maybe I will order two charger from Zero with cable. :-\
Terry, I really admire your courage to strip the Zero, in Germany it is not possible to modify so much.
But one more question, what have you done with your rear brake? :o
At the moment I make a new holder for the Dash, the original angle of view and look of the dash is strange. I will post some pics.
Next, I try to connect the "High Beam Flash-to-Pass" switch to the ECO switch. When I pull it the regenerative braking increase.
Maybe this will bring back a piece of your rear brake ;)
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Now quick question about fast charging: Does anybody know if it damages the batteries to charge them faster? Due to heat generate by fast current?
Anybody with knowledge about that?
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Now quick question about fast charging: Does anybody know if it damages the batteries to charge them faster? Due to heat generate by fast current?
Anybody with knowledge about that?
I believe Zero authorizes use of up to 4 chargers simultaneously (on board + 3 external). I imagine the heat generated with more than 4 would be too high and would deteriorate the battery too much.
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yes but if you are in no rush, I would imagine that it is much better to charge the battery slowly... Just my hunch...
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Hi Larry295,
Charging and discharging lets your battery age, the harder you do the faster it age.
But if the life time of the FZ9 is 302,000 miles (487,000 km) it should not be a problem.
Additionally the years before you have charged all Zeros with 3KWh with the 1KW charger.
If you do now the 9KWh with 3KW it should be the same for the battery.
very strange ???
I asked my dealer he should order 2 Charger for me and ask if all is included for the triple charge.
But the European Office told my dealer I will lose Warranty if I use more than one additionally charger!
I asked Zero for that (yesterday) but didn't receive an answer till now.
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ya off course there's a lot of lifetime in those batteries.
But since I am strictly commuting, I don't mind charging it overnight. So no need to fast charge for me, therefore better treatment of the batteries overall.
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very strange ???
I asked my dealer he should order 2 Charger for my and ask if all is included for the triple charge.
But the European Office told my dealer I will lose Warranty if I use more than one additionally charger!
I asked Zero for that (yesterday) but didn't receive an answer till now.
The Zero has a connection build in to connect a second charger - at least my 2011S ! So this is available and cannot create problems on warranty. Guess ideally it should be the offical Zero supplied charger. if you try another one it might be a problem.
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ya off course there's a lot of lifetime in those batteries.
But since I am strictly commuting, I don't mind charging it overnight. So no need to fast charge for me, therefore better treatment of the batteries overall.
I'm like Larry295. My Zero usage just doesn't justify needing a quick charge. I commute, run errands, but I'm not pushing the range so ultimately I have all night (or 8 hours at work) to charge. So slow-charge is easy for me, and certainly doesn't hurt the batteries.
Do you think that they built the Zero thinking fast charging would be a "not-so-well-used" feature?? In general, I would think when you want to fast charge, you're likely not at your house. Which means carting extra chargers around, and they're relatively heavy and bulky. Plugging two chargers into the same 120 outlet stretches a 15A circuit -- official public charging stations likely require some kind of J1772 adapter setup. And the extra chargers aren't cheap.
Maybe the 2013 Zero's will come with a 1kW 120V socket (like the do now) if you want to slow-charge overnight, and a on-board integrated 4kW charger w/ J1772 socket for charging on the road! That would be pretty cool. 8)
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I am also commuting and do not need the fast charge every day, but if I do a lager weekend trip I have some nice spots around with possibility to recharge. And I have to recharge when riding there.
My plan is to install the GIVI Cruiser Case E21 and so I am able to take the 2 charger with my.
I think most do not need to quick charge.
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good idea to take a second charger onboard in the cases and I guess just like in Oz we can plug two chargers easily into one powerboard/ so a "lager" (your typo :) instead of larger) stops will do it. NB: Lager = a type of beer overhere.
Now we only need to work out to get those cases and the mounts without buying the police bike.
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This is what I made with a Givi T470 (extendable bag). It requires some work, but is not difficult at all
- I modified the straps (it is originally designed as a tank bag, not a tail one).
- No additional drilling made on the bike chassis.
- I have made the "main" quick release connection with reinforced plastic side release buckles (I used an structural special acrylic two components adhesive to do it -do not try regular glue- it does not glue these PP plastics)
- I'm planning in testing a "hybrid" side release on it (aluminium + plastic)
- It fits very well, and is not very wide.
- You may fit one charger + cables without extending the bag -and maybe a second one- extending it, but this maybe a bit challenging...
- I added a 2nd strap to increase safety (I heard one of the forum members almost had an accident with a bag...)
- You can remove it from the saddle in less than 30 seconds and use it as a rucksack...
If you would like/need further information do not hesitate to ask
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Just to clear my posted commentary.
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very strange ???
I asked my dealer he should order 2 Charger for me and ask if all is included for the triple charge.
But the European Office told my dealer I will lose Warranty if I use more than one additionally charger!
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I got the information from Zero Motorcycles European Office that I can charge with 2 or 3 additional charger. I guess there was a misunderstanding.
So I ordered 2 charger for may "side bags" project.
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A company called Modular EV Power sells UL-listed J1772 inlets and control boards (AVC1 & AVC2) to generate the J1772 signals.
http://modularevpower.com/ (http://modularevpower.com/)
I think I'm going to wait and see what Zero does next year for the 2013 bikes.. and see if the charging solution can be adapted to the 2012s. If not then I will probably take a look at a faster charger setup as well.
offthegrid, can you draw up a quick diagram of how you have the chargers wired up?
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Eventually, if electric motorcycles are used for long rides, instead of trying to get the charge times down, it makes more sense to design a bike that has easily replaceable batteries so instead of recharging, you would just trade in your depleted batteries for recharged ones at a service station and be on your way...just like buying gas or bottled gas for that matter, so it could be a grocery store.
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Hey guys I don't have a diagram handy, but I experimented with a few different setups before the proper connectors were available from zero.
Right now I have a J1772 port that I cut into and soldered 2 10 gauge wires that each have a Delta Q/Computer power supply female end. This is still in place on the bike right now
I originally had spliced and soldered a 4 wire Anderson powerpole connector to each of the charger output ends to connect all 4 wires in parallel. Jon at Zero a few weeks ago sent me the orange braided anderson Y-connectors so I have 2 chargers connected to the side port, and two to the back port behind the motor controller. When riding I disconnect the side port connection.
Here's a picture from www.facebook.com/lifeoffthegrid (http://www.facebook.com/lifeoffthegrid) dated may 14th, so before the y-connectors were available and about 2 weeks after delivery of my motorcycle, when I was tinkering with different methods of delivering the Level 2 charging to the batteries. Here it is charging with 3 chargers, but I am not using the actual green anderson connector on the end of the Delta Q charger since I had only 2 ports and 3 connectors.
(http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/389315_277607319001746_2033779752_n.jpg)
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Eventually, if electric motorcycles are used for long rides, instead of trying to get the charge times down, it makes more sense to design a bike that has easily replaceable batteries so instead of recharging, you would just trade in your depleted batteries for recharged ones at a service station and be on your way...just like buying gas or bottled gas for that matter, so it could be a grocery store.
Unfortunately, that would require standardized battery packs and installation/connection designs. I don't see that ever happening. Like most manufactured products technological advances and designs, it seems to me that few companies want to conform to what any other company is doing (and when they try, they get sued). There are lots of examples of this and only a few examples of firms getting together and standardizing a design (like VHS or 120V AC).
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Hi Terry,
thanks for sharing your knowledge. I have some more questions because I can not exactly see what you did.
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8007/7516193148_68a68c232b.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/79924060@N07/7516193148/)
Bild05 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/79924060@N07/7516193148/#) von BSDThw (http://www.flickr.com/people/79924060@N07/) auf Flickr
If you open/cut the DC line with the Anderson connector how many cables are there?
The Anderson connector has 2 Power pins battery +/- and 2 smaller pins. How are this small pins connected?
I see 4 wires 2x red and 2x black out of each original charger wire. Why is it 2-times. I would expect one red and one black cable.
What are the black boxes I marked at the photos? ( connectors / fuses )
You have explained the second battery circuit is at "the back port behind the motor controller"
is the green box your connection to the back port?
If not how can I connect there, where and what must be opened to reach the back port.
(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7133/7516196026_58bc1fa660.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/79924060@N07/7516196026/)
Bild04 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/79924060@N07/7516196026/#) von BSDThw (http://www.flickr.com/people/79924060@N07/) auf Flickr
Thanks in advance for answering my questions.
Thomas
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The black boxes are in-line automotive 30A fuses that I used just as a precautionary measure because of how many amps we are dealing with should something not work as planned, although it turned out to be unnecessary. There are 4 wires in each harness, I believe it was white, black, green and blue, and the anderson powerpoles were a quick connection to join the who chargers output (72V 12A) together into a single Anderson connector. (72V 24A) I used that for about a month until Zero sent me the orange braided Y-connectors. Don't try to make your own, trust me, theirs are much better and I think one comes with each quick charge kit you buy so no need to make your own. They just weren't available yet when I got my chargers.
The green box as you refer to is two mated anderson connectors. You will see one of these plugged into the back of the battery box in the middle near the fuses on the right hand side. It's a little tough to reach. Good luck!!
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Thanks for explanations,
hope you share more of your experiences with us.
As much as I now you are the only one charging (regularly) with 4KW.
I saw your post about the battery and calculation, but you are really a "Zero Tester".
You quick charge you put a lot of miles in short time you ride at all weather condition, with additional load, that is a wonderful study.
I like your style, keep it up!